7mm -3300/160; 3200/175?

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preacher

Handloader
Aug 19, 2012
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I have owned 26" barreled 7mm STW and 7mm RUM, plus one 26" 7mm Rem Mag. I was never able able to get these kind of "Bob Hagel" speeds out of them. I was able to run 3100 out of the 160 (3200 w/the bigger cases) and 3000-3050/175. As a young man, I read Bob's Book on cartridges and his use of the 7mm Mashburn Super Mag. As I understand it, this is the Mashburn that has even less powder capacity than the Rem Mag, am I wrong? Hal said one could get the titled speeds (well maybe 3100/175) but others claim that 3200/175gr is doable. Most claim this is achievable in the 404 based rounds. I could only find a few claims where the 28 Nosler can get these speeds, but it is just a "shortened" 7m RUM. Are these claims done by higher than normal pressure? I like the "idea" of stretched string trajectory ( to 400 yds w/+3" zero) and "tons of fun" Thump on critters. How and Who is getting these kinds of speeds w/o Red Lining the Dragon? Anyone of you successful 7mm Mag guys want to chime in?
 
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I played with the 7 RUM and got 3200 with the 160 AB. It shot well under MOA so I never tried for more of a good thing. I've never shot or loaded for the 7mm STW.

JD338
 
I just fell back to 140-150gr for the flat trajectory's, even in the RUM. But that 3300160 has been a White Whale for me in a 7mm Mag! Its why I don't have one right now!
 
Even the 150 gr at 3100 out of my 280 AI is impressive. The 150 ABLR drops them in their tracks. On 300 yard + kills, I've heard the unmistakable wack of the bullet impact.
The 160 at 3300 would be nice but it's not necessary. The critters die pretty quickly at lower speeds.

JD338
 
JD338 said:
Even the 150 gr at 3100 out of my 280 AI is impressive. The 150 ABLR drops them in their tracks. On 300 yard + kills, I've heard the unmistakable wack of the bullet impact.
The 160 at 3300 would be nice but it's not necessary. The critters die pretty quickly at lower speeds.

JD338
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AHHHH you have to remember that the good Preacher needs to singe his eyebrows when he touches off his creations.:oops::oops::LOL::ROFLMAO: Just joking:rolleyes:;)
 
Ssssshh! I didn't want "everyone" knowing my best killing 35 WAI loads ran an estimated 72K+! ha
 
My old gunsmith told me once he talked with a Weatherby guy at the Vegas Shot Show. He was told that Weatherby's bigger rounds run between 72 and 74K! One and done and "go buy another high dollar box of ammo}! ha
 
"As a young man, I read Bob's Book on cartridges and his use of the 7mm Mashburn Super Mag. As I understand it, this is the Mashburn that has even less powder capacity than the Rem Mag, am I wrong?"

The Super Mashburn is closer to the 7STW.Actually there were 3 different 7mm Mashburn's. The short Magnum, the Super version, and the Long which was based on a full lengthH&H case. The Super is a shortened version at 2.635". Just a tad longer than a 300 Win mag case.I have two 7STW's.One is a Remington Sendero with a 26" barrel,the other is a Remington 700 with a 26" Lilja barrel.The Sendero barrel has some throat erosion and will digest a higher load than the Lilja.I had to back off about two grains from what I was loading in the Sendero.So every rifle is different.I can get a little over 3400fps with 150gr,3200fps with 160gr and 3100fps with 175gr.It's burning about ten more grains of the same powder with the same bullet weights that I use in my 7mags.It's roughly about 200fps gain over a 7mag at a cost of about ten more grains of powder.Mag box length is a big factor with this cartridge because it's so long.The Mashburn is just a tad shorter.Really the 28 Nosler may be a better choice with it's shorter,fatter case.
 
Admittedly, that 28 Nosler intrigues me, however just not a LRH. I like to snoop n poop around the edges of dark timber and aspens. Even up on the ridges, 250 has been my longest shot. I average 171 yds on the four elk I've shot and only 75yds on all the mule deer I've taken, ha. I on purpose shot my first antelope at 347 very long steps and a couple at 300, but most have been 75 to 150 yds. So really, a nice 308 would have done everything but I like to use big guns on elk! ha That old Hornady LM 180 gave me 2910 fps in my 30-06, took my first cow with it. I "wanted more'. I have since used a 375 H&H, 338WM and 300WM. The one I'm pimping out now is a 338/06 Ackley Improved with a 300WSM in tow. I am compromising for both with LW Hammers though, the 175 and the 154. Both give me "hold on hair" out to 400. Heck, I might want to pop ol Bigfoot out that far! But these flat shooters have helped me shoot through "holes" in the woods. I can put it "anywhere in the eye"!
 
I know the 7STW is certainly a step up from the 7mag.It's really fast and seems to hit with a little more authority.It's a lot like a 300 Win Mag,where the 7mag to me is a lot like a good 30-06.I like my 7mag with 150 and 160gr bullets,but I really like the 7STW with 160 and 175 gr bullets.
 
preacher said:
My old gunsmith told me once he talked with a Weatherby guy at the Vegas Shot Show. He was told that Weatherby's bigger rounds run between 72 and 74K! One and done and "go buy another high dollar box of ammo}! ha
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I would agree to that statement. When I first started out with my 460 , I got an old elephant box of 500gr Soft Points. Every case had a nice ejector mark. If you look inside an old Weatherby case the bottom is flat , newer ones have some material removed giving the primer pocket a raised look inside. I believe the older case could handle more pressure , just my thought.
 
My 7MM STW has a 24" and produces 3222 fps with the Federal Premium 160 gr AccuBond ammunition. I have no pressure signs in my rifle or the fired brass.
Typically 3200 fps with a 160 gr bullet requires a 26" barrel for the 7mm RUM.
Some barrels are just faster than others!

I can tell you that the on-game performance at this level is very good.
I had been plenty happy with the on-game performance I had gotten from the 7mm Rem Mag using Federal Premium 165gr SGK ammo.
I wasn't looking for a STW, but I had sold my RH Rem 700 LSS in 7mm Rem Mag and ordered a LH Rem 700 LSS in 7mm Rem Mag when they introduced the LH version. Unfortunately they could not get me one and I ended up with a 270 Win.
Nice rifle and worked well on the moose, mule deer, caribou, and mountain goat I took with that rifle...but it wasn't quite the same performance I had received from the 7mm Rem Mag on mule deer, elk and mountain goat. Nothing against the 270 as it did kill those animals cleanly, just not with the same level of authority. Fond enough of the platform that my LH Rem 700 XCR/LSS crossover in 280 Rem is very similar! I'm just a bigger fan of the 7mm than I am of the 270, as I currently have a 7mm-08, a 280 Rem, and a 7MM STW, (and I wouldn't pass up nice LH rifle in 7mm REM Mag or 7mm WSM, or a 280AI), whereas I have just a 270 Win and a 270 WSM (I don't currently have a 270 Wby but really like the cartridge).

I was still looking for a LH 7mm Rem Mag when I came across the used custom LH Sako AV in 7MM STW for a steal of a deal I could not pass up!
Over 25 years later and more than 3 dozen big game animals from 15-475 yards and I am still not looking back! It will produce 1" groups @ 300 yards when I do my part...and it doesn't beat me up...even when my shoulder was really bad.
What's not to love about that kind of performance!
I've never felt the need (or desire) for more from a 7mm.
 
Sounds like a wonderful rifle you have! I had hoped to get that kind of performance from my Mod 70 7mm STW. My very first 7mm STW was in a Sendero. Back in mid 90's. I had intended to use only the 140s in it. Once I had it all set up and a good load worked up with the 140 NBT, I felt the need to give it to a good friend of mine. Over the years he has taken many head of game with it. About 5 yrs later I tried that Mod 70 in 7 STW. I really wanted that Federal Premium 160 NPT load to work, but, as mentioned, it was just inconsistent. By that it would open up to 1 1/2 ". I gave that rifle to another friend who was thrilled with it. I still had my 35 Whelan AI as my main rifle then. No withdrawal, ha.
 
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Sonny sent me a 1986 article by Bob himself on the Mashburn. I really believe, in his book with pictures, he sudstituted the 3300/160 with his 3300/140. He normally got 3200+/160. Well, I for sure got 3300+ in the 7mm STW and in that 7mm RUM, but neither shot the 160 consistently. I also just used the Barnes 140 TTSX in that RUM. Very flat for me and a Ballistic Plex reticle! I learned so much from his article, shout out to Sonny Beretz!
 
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TXbaldhunter said:
"As a young man, I read Bob's Book on cartridges and his use of the 7mm Mashburn Super Mag. As I understand it, this is the Mashburn that has even less powder capacity than the Rem Mag, am I wrong?"

The Super Mashburn is closer to the 7STW.Actually there were 3 different 7mm Mashburn's. The short Magnum, the Super version, and the Long which was based on a full lengthH&H case. The Super is a shortened version at 2.635". Just a tad longer than a 300 Win mag case.I have two 7STW's.One is a Remington Sendero with a 26" barrel,the other is a Remington 700 with a 26" Lilja barrel.The Sendero barrel has some throat erosion and will digest a higher load than the Lilja.I had to back off about two grains from what I was loading in the Sendero.So every rifle is different.I can get a little over 3400fps with 150gr,3200fps with 160gr and 3100fps with 175gr.It's burning about ten more grains of the same powder with the same bullet weights that I use in my 7mags.It's roughly about 200fps gain over a 7mag at a cost of about ten more grains of powder.Mag box length is a big factor with this cartridge because it's so long.The Mashburn is just a tad shorter.Really the 28 Nosler may be a better choice with it's shorter,fatter case.
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I guess I was thinking of the 7mm PRC as being comparable to the Mashburn, glad I was wrong. Only reason I can see to own a 7mm PRC is to shoot the long, 180+ heavies, which I don't have confidence in their "up close/Timber shots" ability to hold up. I'm am way beyond OCD on wanting tough bullets for heavy game, ha.
 
No the 7mm PRC really isn't much different than the 7mag.It is built around Hornady bullets using a faster twist rate barrel on a short action.The issue I have with some of these cartridges is limited manufactures of brass.Next thing you know is,they come up with something new and the cartridge goes by the wayside and then you can't find brass.I'd much rather build something off a case that's been around for awhile.A good choice for a big 7mm would be necking down the 300 Win Mag case to 7mm.
www.americanhunter.org

An Official Journal Of The NRA | Head to Head: 7mm PRC vs. 7mm Remington Magnum

One is a newbie and one ranks among the most popular hunting cartridges sold to this day, but both have appreciable characteristics. Which cartridge the better choice for the hunter? Here’s a detailed look at the pros and cons of each.
www.americanhunter.org www.americanhunter.org

Chart of All Rifle Cartridges by Case Capacity – Backfire

backfire.tv backfire.tv
 
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That 7mm/300WM is a good looking round, but doesn't one have to neck turn the brass, and neck ream the do-nut out?
 
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