Latest Youth Rifle Idea

Back a few months I asked your opinions on what gun and caliber would be best to start a kid out with. After thinking it over for a while and checking into the makes and models mentioned. Since my wife and I shoot and Encores, I had initially thought this might be a good way to go. But for a kid, even with a cut down stock, would be difficult to open the action and even cock the hammer and put it back on safe easily.

After thinking this all over, here is my idea. Please tell me what you think. (I have a few years to really get this right She's only 6 so I have plenty of time

7-30 Waters in a G2 Contender carbine with a bantam walnut stock with a 2-7 or 3-9 scope and 120 Ballistic Tip or Gameking BTSP.

I'm thinking this would be a fun coyote-deer rifle I could even use with a full size stock while I'm waiting for her to grow up LOL. (I plan to get her a pink Daisy for Christmas this year then maybe a TC Hotshot 22 or a Savage Cub in a couple years). When she is old enough and big enough to handle the Contender rifle, she can use it as long as she likes and then slide into my Encore in 7mm08 when she outgrows it/ can handle more recoil and her 2 year younger brother can step up to the Contender at that time.

What do you think?

I don't know much about the Contender, but starting them out with a .22, letting them get good and comfortable shooting the rimfires, then moving up to a mild centerfire is a proven way to go.

Exact choice of rifle is of course, completely up to you.

A properly fitted rifle, and minimal blast & recoil are good things I'd think. I didn't push my kids either. They moved up from the .22 when they wanted to do so. And when I thought they were ready.

Enjoy - the time with them when they're young is fleeting and precious.

Regards, Guy

Any bolt action "mountain rifle" in 7mm08, 260 rem or 6.5 swede would be great. I hear Savage has re-introduced rifles in .300 sav and 250 savage. If you reload and can take advantage of modern bullets in these calibers they would be I-friggen-deal. A lighter rifle with a full length stock can easily be trimmed down and fitted with a new recoil pad. Those savage boltguns really shoot and the price is right. If you want something fancier, Richards microfit makes stocks in a myriad of laminate colors and will custom cut length of pull. Their stocks are very comfortable to shoot but order early. They take a long time to arrive.

I believe Ruger makes/made a short rifle in 6.5 swede and 7X57mm also.

7-30 waters, nice , I thought of having my savage 340 re barreled in that, but it shoots to damn good just the way it is. And if savage is offering a model in the 250 again then thankyou savage, I'm in. 8)

+1 to what Guy said. If I read you right you were thinking about Not using the encocre. I guess I would plan on a bolt action. It is the easiest to operate and verify safety IMHO. You can start with anything I guess as long as they are ready. Dont discount the ole 243. Id say the 250 Savage (what else :grin but the 243 has so many options. Fun to plan aint it? Mean time there may be a tea party waiting for you. Dont miss it. CL

I guess I would mildly disagree with the single shot being less safe. You can see the if action is in battery, or broken; you know how many shots are in the gun; and when crossing fencelines, you can unload much more quickly. I like the idea of a single shot break action for a first gun.




Doesn't mean I'm going to go that way for Nolan, though.

YS, I really like the youth model sized bolt rifles. They come with compact stocks and allow you to just get an adult stock for them as they grow up. My son is to that point now. He was bought a M700 Youth 243 at about 6-7 years old. We shot reduced 243 loads for a long time. Now, being 13, I just bought a Limbsaver slip on recoil pad to gain a little length on the stock for him. I will keep it that way until he is just a touch bigger and then put a proper stock on the rifle for him.

Winchester makes some very nice Featherweight Compacts in 243, 7-08 and 308. No reason any of them cannot be downloaded nicely with lighter bullets and then loaded up to full steam as they progress. The boy is shooting full bore 100gr PT's at 2900 now without issue. If I was to do it again, I would go 7-08 or 260 Rem if it was available. Getting them into a rifle they can have forever means alot to me. It would be nice if they could hunt with that one rifle for a long time until they either buy more (like us) or just continue hunting with that one rifle. I don't find anything particularly unsafe about a bolt rifle. You are going to watch him/her load the rifle, chamber a round when told by you and so forth. I am a hawk on my boy about muzzle awareness and will still get on him if I see a bad trait developing. It has made him a pretty safe young man, and he shoots pretty also. He has a 17HMR for plinking and just working his field skills. Works great. Shoot the rimfire a bunch and shoot the centerfire enough to be comfortable. Overall, I think you are in for a great time training your young ones the skills to make them independent rifle owners! Scotty

It's also a pretty simple process to turn a bolt repeater into a single shot, either through a reversable mod such as a magazine block or just good discipline on the youngsters part. I think bolt actions and single shots are both safe firearms. The only issue I have with single shots is the older exposed hammer models without secondary safeties. I'm also not a fan of the Rem 700 safety for younger shooters. It seems to be located in the perfect place to snag on brush or be bumped to fire while brushing snow off or fiddling with the magnification on your scope. I much prefer the Savage, Winchester or best of all 3 pos. or Buehler type mauser type safeties.

Thought of another great youth rifle also. Cant remember the model number but Savage made a 30-30 bolt gun for some time. They are very accurate with handloads and use a box magazine so handloads can use pointy bullets. My friends was a no BS 200 yard deer gun with the BT 150. They turn up quite often at gunshows and are a handy fast handling rifle that won't set you back much money.

Gm weatherby man":3jy68y6i said:

7-30 waters, nice , I thought of having my savage 340 re barreled in that, but it shoots to damn good just the way it is. And if savage is offering a model in the 250 again then thankyou savage, I'm in. 8)

Click to expand...

http://www.gunsamerica.com/OnDemand/Sav ... /18602.htm here ya go!

The Ruger Hawkeye 77 compact in 7mm08 or 260 would fit the bill nicely if only they didnt put such a rediculously short barrel on it. A 20 inch barrel would be perfect on it, I think. Maybe getting a standard length 20-22" barreled Hawkeye with a compact or youth stock would be the way to go and last a lifetime.

I think you'd be well served by the Contender in 7-30. It's a round he could learn a great deal loading for, as well.

I went bolt gun for my son, though he's not yet made it to season #1 with the gun (this fall). He's been using a bolt 22lr for several years, so the transition will be natural and linear, I think. But, if you frequently shoot the Encore, your son is used to the sight and operation of the single shot break action, and he'll likely make that transition easily, too.

I do like the idea of safety at fencelines, etc. I'll be taking my son dove hunting this fall (maybe) and I'm looking at a break action single or double with a youth stock for his first shotgun, too. Will have to see what the budget will support. Might be next year before it supports anything, but we'll see.

Regardless, there are a lot of great suggestions on this board for first rifles. The nice part about the Contender is that he could make it into a full-length rifle with just a buttstock change, and he could even make it into a 7-30 handgun if he liked, later on. Or any number of other things along the way.

When my youngest son was ready to graduate from the .22 to a center-fire, all I did was pop the little old 6mm Remington into a Remington "youth" stock. It worked wonders for him! The rifle fit, and that stock had a nice cushy recoil pad. He's since grown of course and the rifle is back in the original walnut stock. He sure likes that thing. Easy on the shoulder, accurate, and just flat wipes out varmints & mule deer!

YS, I like your singleshot idea.
My oldest has been shooting that little NEF handly rifle in .223 that I picked up when sportsmans was going out of business. I was going to get a 762x39 or 6.8 spc barrel for it, but NEF doesn't make either one. So, I'll go with the old standby's, .270 Win and .308, a just put together some mild loads for her, and the rest of them.....

You can now get an AR style collapsible for the NEF. That will probably be one of my next purchases.

Savage youth in 7mm-08 or 260.

I would like to build a 25-35 on nef platform, may make a wild cat cartridge out of it. I just like to be different, change it up a little. :wink: I'm at work so all I can do is read your threads and dream about the next toy or hunt. :roll:

Gm weatherby man":2i6etmj3 said:

I would like to build a 25-35 on nef platform, may make a wild cat cartridge out of it. I just like to be different, change it up a little. :wink: I'm at work so all I can do is read your threads and dream about the next toy or hunt. :roll:

Click to expand...

Dont remember what it's called but there is a .25-35 wildcat. The shoulder is considerably blown out and the neck shortened. I remember when I read about it that it approaches 250 sav velocities with very short case life.

Polaris, I was think of maybe taking a 7-30 waters and necking it down to25 cal., maybe change shoulder angle, I'll have to discuss with a gun smith as well as your guys input is always helpful .

YoteSmoker":272onoho said:

The Ruger Hawkeye 77 compact in 7mm08 or 260 would fit the bill nicely if only they didnt put such a rediculously short barrel on it. A 20 inch barrel would be perfect on it, I think. Maybe getting a standard length 20-22" barreled Hawkeye with a compact or youth stock would be the way to go and last a lifetime.

Click to expand...

....................For hunting, stick with a bolt action. Single shots are ok, but imo they cannot beat the faster repeatability of a bolt action. With single shots, there is always the possibility of fumbling and dropping a live round when reloading in between the shots.

Many are of the opinion that 16.5" barrels on the Ruger compacts or on any rifle for that matter, are as you say "ridiculously short." Given the same cartridge, a 3 1/2" longer barrel to say a 20", a even a 22" er, won`t make any killing difference on any game hunted. And given the same cartridge as well, there will be little noise level differences to the ear between a 20" barrel and one that is 3 1/2" shorter. Besides, good hearing protection should always be worn for all barrel lengths.

The theme behind the Ruger compact is exactly that;,,,"compact".......Imo, there isn`t another bolt action rifle anywhere that handles as well, is as fast to the shoulder, or is as easy to carry like the Ruger compact. That applies for the youths as well.

Amongst my three rifles, the Ruger Frontier is perhaps the favorite go to piece for the field.

At 6'3" & 240 lbs and believe it or not, the Frontier is not too small even for my size. At only 35.5" long, it is also a great rifle for the youths.

A Ruger compact chambered in either the 243 or in the 260 would be ideal. And yes, the Rugers last a lifetime.

And given the same loadings and cartridge, did you know that the "ridiculously" short barrel on a Ruger compact, is very capable of retaining 95% or better the velocity of a 24" barrel?.....Yep! It sure can..........Been there/done that.

Big Squeeze, I have owned a Model 7 in 308 with a 18.5" barrel. I loved how short and light it was but the muzzle jump and blast was quite noticeable (at the range with ear plugs). On the subject of velocity, it was quite a bit slower than my 26" barreled 308 with same weight bullets. Velocity was not my main objective so I wasn't overly dissapointed but a bit surprised that a 165 grain bullet couldn't make it up to 2500 fps with a good dose of Varget or 4064.

Later I tried a Model 660 Mohawk in 222 Remington with the same length barrel once at the range. Even with this low capacity cartridge and 50 grain bullets, the jump and blast (with ear plugs) was more than I wanted for a varmint gun for my interests.

I kept the 22 Hornet w/ 24" barrel and 22-250 w/26" barrel but sold the little carbine. I can only imagine that for a kid shooting a 308 based cartridge in a 16.5" barrel would be a bit intimidating with even more muzzle blast and jump. The 6.8 SPC chambering makes the most sense to me on that platform, but is quite a bit more limited than a 260 or 7mm08 with a 20" barrel, imo.

YoteSmoker":cyf2gd7k said:

Big Squeeze, I have owned a Model 7 in 308 with a 18.5" barrel. I loved how short and light it was but the muzzle jump and blast was quite noticeable (at the range with ear plugs). On the subject of velocity, it was quite a bit slower than my 26" barreled 308 with same weight bullets. Velocity was not my main objective so I wasn't overly dissapointed but a bit surprised that a 165 grain bullet couldn't make it up to 2500 fps with a good dose of Varget or 4064.

Later I tried a Model 660 Mohawk in 222 Remington with the same length barrel once at the range. Even with this low capacity cartridge and 50 grain bullets, the jump and blast (with ear plugs) was more than I wanted for a varmint gun for my interests.

I kept the 22 Hornet w/ 24" barrel and 22-250 w/26" barrel but sold the little carbine. I can only imagine that for a kid shooting a 308 based cartridge in a 16.5" barrel would be a bit intimidating with even more muzzle blast and jump. The 6.8 SPC chambering makes the most sense to me on that platform, but is quite a bit more limited than a 260 or 7mm08 with a 20" barrel, imo.

Click to expand...

YS, my boy has handed the 20" 243 for a long time. It is more the stock than barrel length. I don't like overly short barrels on sporters. Duty carry weapons are one thing, but for hunting, I will take the extra barrel length, it is free speed! Scotty